Keep Your Content Relatable: Peter Lisoskie’s Vision for the Relationship Economy

Jim [00:00:01]:
Peter Lisoskie is, not only the founder of Relatable, but he's also, you know, started the company that Relatable is under Iprolio. But he's he's an amazing guy, you know, getting to hang around, Peter and his, his brilliance. He he knows all about, like, human psychology, but but enough of, talking about this amazing, man. Let's let's let's bring him on.

Chris Stone [00:00:25]:
Welcome to Dealcasters, Peter.

Peter Lisoskie [00:00:27]:
Thank you. And I just gotta say that, the Detroit Lions are category 1, and they will go to the Super Bowl, and they will win. And I'm from Detroit. So there you go.

Chris Stone [00:00:38]:
I didn't know that. I didn't know that. Wow. Oh, automatically our best guest ever. Way to go.

Jim [00:00:47]:
There you go. Yep. Yeah. And we have a lot of fun talking about sports because, you know, Peter actually has quite the background in, baseball. And, used to run an actual, well, I'll let Peter tell us tell us a little bit about what he did with baseball because I I've always been fascinated with that.

Peter Lisoskie [00:01:04]:
Baseball was, you know, was, kind of a thing of, I'll tell you a quick story. So when I was in high school, I was playing ball. The, football coach approached me one day, and I we had to we had to play other sports cause I played, I played basketball too, but our basketball coach always said, Hey, who wanna play basketball? Because we were a shorter team. I think the tallest guy was like 6, 5 on the team. You guys gotta get in shape because we're gonna run up and down the court. So I tried cross country 1 year and I said, nuts that I'm not running around like a fool. So I went and did soccer and I got to be pretty good. I made the varsity there the 1st year I did it.

Peter Lisoskie [00:01:40]:
And, you know, this is back when Paley was around and she, we used playing cow pastures and jumped over cow pies and flights. But the football coach came to me one day because he saw me. I was I was left wing and I was going up the side of the cross and he came up. He goes, hey, you you ever talk about playing football? You could be our kicker. And I said, coach, I said, here's the thing. I said, I'll tell you what's gonna happen. I said, if those big linemen on the other side of that team come across the line and they're not blocked, I'm picking the ball up running the other way. So So you probably don't want skidger.

Peter Lisoskie [00:02:12]:
He goes, no.

Jim [00:02:13]:
I don't think so.

Peter Lisoskie [00:02:15]:
I stuck with baseball. I played baseball in college and then, coached for about 20 years. We had, it was Northwest Baseball Academy. We had about 372 guys that played college ball from d one to juco. And then a couple guys, you guys know John Lester. He came through our organization from the red sox. Wow. Bobby Jenks, who was one of the first to broke the the triple digit mark.

Peter Lisoskie [00:02:37]:
He came through. He that's a whole I mean, we that would be a whole show in itself talking about all those things that happened over the over the years with baseball, but that's my that's my background Jim was referring to.

Chris Stone [00:02:49]:
That's amazing. And so I think a lot of a lot of people that are that tune into our show and and our audience, a lot of entrepreneurs, a lot of solopreneurs, a lot of small business owners, a lot of people are in in some, Peter, are maybe podcasters that are maybe a little fearful of clicking on the camera and figuring out how to how to do it, whether it's a big camera or their phone. And, I think, you know, when a new you know, it seems like you wake up every day, and there's there's 16 new AI, pieces of software and a couple of video, pieces of software, that all kind of do the same thing. But you, are not just somebody who just jumped into this thing, you know, yesterday. You know, you've you've got a history, and I think it's something like 18 or something patents that you've got under your name, and you've been on the sort of the tech forefront for for well over 30 years. So at at this point, when what's different now in what you're seeing now in in in tech versus what you saw maybe 20, 30 years ago?

Peter Lisoskie [00:04:04]:
No. Well, 20, 30 years ago, we're using corded phones going around the corner to get. But, you know, Chris and Jim, I I look at things as far as, big social economic or what we call mega trends. You guys know mega trends, in tech, Internet's a mega trend, cell phones are mega trend. Last I checked, there's 96 0.2% of the population of the 8,000,000,000 people in the world. They have a cell phone. Yeah. So these are things that they're just you know, they're they're not gonna stop.

Peter Lisoskie [00:04:35]:
But there's these things called socioeconomic megatrends, and I'm always looking to see what changes or shifts had occur have occurred out there. Right? So before I started with the relatable, because one of our monitors, Jim, knows this. One of the questions we always ask in my company is what else is possible? And that leads us to a lot of innovation inspiration. But these 4 trends, the first and when I say these because we talked to a lot of people, Jim, to us too, in our company. And everybody, when they hear them, they go, yep. That's true. So the first one is, nobody wants to be sold anymore. Everybody wants to buy.

Peter Lisoskie [00:05:15]:
And I tell people I did a a post on LinkedIn, which was really popular. I said, look, you guys, if you're in marketing and you wanna know, kind of how people are approaching things, your best marketing tool ever, it's like a genie in a lamp, is called a mirror. All you gotta do is go find a mirror in your house, look yourself in the mirror, and ask one question. How do I buy? And if you answer, I go online and do research. I always say, don't you think your customers and clients are doing that too? And so if you look at that, that megatrend has already shifted. And what that means is you're seeing it in the statistics. This is why email marketing is dying. Sales funnels are dying.

Peter Lisoskie [00:05:53]:
Cold calling is dying because people have shifted away from a sales funnel to a buyer's phone. And so we are no longer are removing away from the attention economy and lead generation, which is defined as I invite you into my sales process and persuade you to buy to the relationship economy, which is already here and demand gen, which is I am invited into the buyer's process when they're ready to buy. K? But to do that, you have to go through awareness consideration to get to readiness, and you also need to pay attention and build relationships and trust and things like that. So that's the first shift. The second shift is, people want to build relationships with people. You guys know the old timeless phrase. I tell people all the time, I don't care how much AI we have, how much tech we have. And I've been tech my whole life.

Peter Lisoskie [00:06:47]:
People do business with people. They like know, and trust. We all know that saying the other one I add to it is people, share businesses with people they like, know, and trust. And so if you look at what's going on in the second shift, HubSpot did a study last year, Chris, in, JIP. And what they found is that 70% of all consumers, they don't care about companies and brands as much as they want direct interaction through video with the CEO or founder or head honcho. That means I don't care if you're a solopreneur or you're a fortune 500 CEO, you better get in front of that camera and talk to your customers because that is what they're looking for nowadays. They you can't hide behind your brand. You can't hide behind your marketing or your PR.

Peter Lisoskie [00:07:33]:
You gotta get out. So that's another shift. The 3rd shift is, you guys know this, one size fits all marketing just doesn't cut it anymore. People want personal and relevant. And so that's what we did in relatable is we let them choose their own experience or adventure through video while they're interacting, because Chris, what may be a priority for you may not be a priority for Jim or me. So you've gotta give them the ability to choose their own adventure or their own experience that's personal and relevant to them. And then 4th, the last thing, people are not looking for a monologue anymore. They don't wanna talk at you.

Peter Lisoskie [00:08:10]:
That's email marketing. That's even passive video. Passive video is going to be like the 8 track tape coming up in the future, just like a 8 track went to cassette and all the way to cloud because people do not want to talk at you. They want dialogue. They don't want monologue. They want interaction. They want engagement, and more importantly, people want to be listened to and heard. In all of the stuff in social media these days, no one is listening.

Peter Lisoskie [00:08:37]:
It's a bunch of noise out there, but people are are wanting. They're craving this ability to be listened to and to be heard. It's kinda like, you know, product reviews and things like that. Well so that those four behaviors, all I did was I said, well, okay. That and also how do humans form relationships that all got put into the product that we have today called relatable.

Jim [00:09:01]:
Yeah. It it and it's you know, Chris, I think, you know, I've told you it's blown me away, not only what it is is doing, but the development of of relatable and how it's really, you know, making a difference. And I think a lot of it is and Peter talks about this a lot, and and Peter, I love you to to, you know, go into this more, as we kinda, like, have these 2, sets of people. We are actually what we call the native analogs. We grew up with technology, where the younger folks, and I don't know what age that starts at, they're the native digitals. Right? They grew up with the phone or tablet in their hand, and it's it's just natural to them to use technology. And so, you know, us older folks have to realize that as their buying power grows, how are we going to relate to them? So so, Peter, you wanna kinda go into that a little bit more?

Peter Lisoskie [00:09:55]:
Yeah. Sure. That's a good point. That's really the there's a there's it's kind of a clash, but it doesn't have to be. It can be more of an integration between the native analogs, all of us guys that were born before the Internet and cell phones. Right? When you think about it, the iPhone came out in 2007. What is that? 17 years ago? Not a long time. It seems like it was 40 or 50 by the rate of change of technology.

Peter Lisoskie [00:10:18]:
But the cool thing is that there this is the overarching that kind of is the umbrella on these four behaviors that I talked about. So these native digitals, they're 51% of the global population. When I discovered that, I was like, wow, I did not know that. And they're growing. They're 35 and younger. Their primary reality, Jim and Chris, is the digital realm. They're tourists in the physical world. Whereas us analogs, our primary reality is the physical world and we're tourists in the digital world.

Peter Lisoskie [00:10:51]:
Now here's the thing, as you look at that, what happened is because they are the global majority and they're growing, they're all about interaction and community. This is why you're seeing all these communities popping up everywhere because they're driving this. Okay. So that's another, if you look at that, that was the other thing that I looked at and I said, okay, this is not going away. This they're actually the ones that are heralding in the relationship economy. They're the ones that are driving all this, not us old in analogs. You know what we did, right? We invented the internet and then we said, oh, we got this stuff we used to watch called radio and TV. Well, we'll take that ad set and plop it right on the internet.

Peter Lisoskie [00:11:33]:
That's the business model that we've had for years. Right? Because we didn't know any better. These guys come a lot. I mean, I don't know, you know, if you guys have kids or anything, but if you look at kids in their twenties and up, where are they? They're hanging out in discord. They're playing video games with their friends all over the world. That's how they live. I, if you don't, you know, don't know if you don't have kids, you don't know a native digital native digital will come to your door. They'll sit in the car and they'll text you and go, I'm here.

Peter Lisoskie [00:11:59]:
They would never take a gun to the door or not. That's like, what are you talking about? Why do I have to bring your door? You know? But this is the thing that's happened. And because of all of that, this is what's driving all these changes, that are happening in the economy and around the world globally.

Chris Stone [00:12:19]:
So I I I love this because I think this is a great bridge piece for people who are native analogs like ours and want to create communities in the digital space. Right? I I think that is just such a huge disconnect for a lot of people that we talk to, Peter, is, you know, like, oh, I had a Facebook group, and I was doing this, and I have, have this and I have that. But they don't have a real,

Peter Lisoskie [00:12:50]:
I

Chris Stone [00:12:50]:
don't know, a real practical way of of of of reaching the people that that are their audience and and pulling them in. And I feel like relatable is a way for them to be very specific to a specific group of people and say, hey. I'm I'm creating community here, whether it's on Discord or, you know, wherever it is, Mighty Networks. I mean, name a you know, throw a rock, you screen, throw a rock, and you're gonna you're gonna hit that. But I feel like this is a great bridge piece for people to be able to do that. Is are you seeing that with with with customers, of of relatable that are creating these communities?

Peter Lisoskie [00:13:30]:
Yeah. So and, you know, one thing just to kinda back up as, just a half step, Chris, on that is, as you guys know, nowadays, the native digitals are grabbing this too. Everybody's watching or listening. Hence why you guys have this live. You're not writing a, a white paper about what you're doing to deal casters. Right? In fact, the native digital has invented an acronym called TLDR too long. Didn't read. Right.

Peter Lisoskie [00:13:55]:
So we, we have we're, we're doing video and we're doing, audio podcasts exist because you can't watch a video while you're driving a car running, because you're probably gonna either trip and fall and hurt yourself, or you're gonna crash your car. So podcasts have their place, but all this video stuff has its place too. So when you look at relatable, what we did is we said, you know, Jim talked about interactive video relationships. And so I wanna make the distinction because this is why it's a category. Because when I looked at relationships, I said, okay, well, how do how do we form human relationships? Right? You guys have a significant other. You're married. You have a, another person in your life that's significant. Think about it this way.

Peter Lisoskie [00:14:40]:
Right? You can go through awareness, connection, and engagement. Now if you think about that, guys, that's where Facebook, LinkedIn, everything stops. You can't go beyond engagement as social realms. Okay. But in order to develop a relationship, you got to go further. There has to be nurturing trust, building respect, And then for you, you know, us 3 guys it's affinity. If it's a personal relationship, it's intimacy, this is how we do it. So when I looked at this and I said, well, okay, there's interact.

Peter Lisoskie [00:15:10]:
There's about 20 or 25 interactive video companies out there. They do questions. They do branching. They do all this stuff. The problem with it is it does not match the megatrend behaviors because what they're doing is they're taking you from point a to point b. So Chris, that's like you, Jim knows this because I use this analogy a lot, but Chris, if you have a significant other, that's like you going out on the 1st day with a significant other, at the end of the day, you drop to one knee and go, Hey, you want to get married? I mean, do that as humans. You know? Mhmm. So this is where the relationship piece is.

Peter Lisoskie [00:15:44]:
What we did in relatable is, first of all, I said, well, it's gotta be on it's gotta be built for the phone. And I always say relatable is easy enough where all you need is your face, phone, and finger. Because I've traveled all over the world. I've been all over the Middle East. I've been all over Asia, all over Europe, all over South America. And what I learned as a younger man is and even today is you get outside of the United States, most people are on their phones, even for business. They don't have desktops or laptops. Their phone is everything.

Peter Lisoskie [00:16:13]:
It's their business device, their communication device, their entertainment device. It's everything. And the fact that there's 96% of the population. But, secondly, what I wanted to do is I said, well, okay. How do we create these relationships? How do we nurture? So if you remember what I said, everybody wants personal and relevant and choose your own experience. So people come into Relatable in the software app. There are questions. There are, in screen interactions.

Peter Lisoskie [00:16:40]:
Those could be buttons, hotspots, icons, interactives. We call them touchables. But what we do is we track in the software their answers and actions, and then the person who's building these relatable can serve up other interactive video content that is personal and relevant to that person's answers and actions. That's what builds the engagement, the dialogue, the being heard, and these the, the relationship aspect of it. We also can reengage and reconnect where where they pause watching because, you know, look, a lot of times people, life gets in the way. Your baby's crying. You have to go to a meeting, the phone rings. Right.

Peter Lisoskie [00:17:20]:
But you really like to watch the video or interacting with it. And you don't wanna go back and start from the beginning, because we just don't have the attention span to do that anymore. So we built out into, and we are the 1st in the world to really pay attention to not just interactives, but interactives with relationship building in mind because we're in the relationship economy, and we need to support how do you nurture and build trust and accelerate relationships while you are creating demand? Because that that's the second piece is it's no longer lead gen, it's demand generation that we're creating. We attract people to our products and services. We don't sell people our products and services anymore. Because you guys know, right? Think about it. When you, when you go to somebody and they, you know, when you go to a cell phone, you know, you're gonna get sold and your BS meter is at an all time high. It's like, I am not doing that.

Peter Lisoskie [00:18:17]:
Right. We're all like that. I, you know, we have AI blockers on our phone for all the robocalls and all the salespeople that are trying to get ahold of us. And I, you know, frankly, I feel bad for SDRs and BDRs now. And I've talked to a lot of them and they're frustrated as hell because they can't get good leads anymore. They can't get ahold of people anymore. Nobody, they, they shut you out. In fact, I'll give you another stat.

Peter Lisoskie [00:18:40]:
The RAIN group, which is a large research group like Gartner, they did a study last year, and they found out, Chris and Jim, 72% of all b to b buyers never wanna talk to a salesperson, even for enterprise sales. 72%. I mean, so you have to really stop and pause and go, maybe, you know and I've talked to so many CEOs and founders where they admit to me, you know, hey, my email marketing is now working. My, you know, my cell phones are working. What do I do? Right. There's their revenue is starting to dip. They're starting to panic. And this is all because of what has happened in this ship that's already happened.

Chris Stone [00:19:23]:
Yeah. I you know, the sales gig, to your point, whether it's cold calling, I mean, how many times are you looking at your phone, you're seeing a number you don't recognize, and you're like you know? And you you're like, okay. I'm a business owner. I'm a small business owner. I'm an entrepreneur. I'm gonna answer it because it might be something that could you know? And then eventually, you're like, oh, god. Why am I

Peter Lisoskie [00:19:46]:
to let down with it now.

Chris Stone [00:19:47]:
But Yes. It's like, why am I doing this?

Peter Lisoskie [00:19:51]:
So

Chris Stone [00:19:51]:
are so how is how can relatable, like, work with companies that are doing this cold outreach? Like, what what are some maybe some some practical ways that they can use relatable to, to be more than just these these cold call, like, you know, sending out 300, cold calls and maybe getting one person to pick up.

Peter Lisoskie [00:20:14]:
Yeah. Well, we can go through a couple use cases. I don't know. Jim, does it make sense? We could talk about podcast, and we can also talk about just in general what you're talking about, Chris. I'll if you would have time, I'll you'll only give us 3 minutes. I'll cover both. So you guys all know I mean, I don't care where you go. We we all live on LinkedIn because we're b to b, but you can go YouTube.

Peter Lisoskie [00:20:34]:
You can go to Instagram. You can go to x, wherever you wanna go, Facebook. There's fishing holes out there. Right? And people congregate around those fishing holes. So what I say to people is what you have to do is you need to start the demand gen process up in awareness, and you can use relatable to express your different. We talked Jim mentioned a little bit about category design. We can get into that. But here's the thing.

Peter Lisoskie [00:21:03]:
There's hundreds of thousands of SaaS founders like me. There's 100 of 1000 of fractionals, consultants, coaches, whatever you are. So and, you know, you guys know this to be true. The world does not need a better mousetrap. We we have too many. Too many choices, too many. Just too many. So whatever you're creating a product or service, it you better make it different.

Peter Lisoskie [00:21:22]:
That's going to stand out, and then you're creating in category design what's called a unique point of view story. Okay? Which is here is how you're unique and different. Here's the story, the origin story. Jim and I did that, and we have a whole show on YouTube about that, but relatable. But you also say, here's what I stand for, and here's what I stand against. You guys have heard me already in the show. I stand against email marketing, cold calling, sales funnels. I stand against customers as thought of as transactions and wallets and not people in relationships.

Peter Lisoskie [00:21:55]:
And and so you have to do that. And when you do that, the next thing you're doing is what's called change of perspective in category design. And change of perspective from a sales standpoint, Chris and Jim, is really it's your bridge. It's how do you get how do you get them from their hell to your heaven? So in Relatable, what we do is we will go out. I post. You can put you can build in Relatables in LinkedIn posts, in LinkedIn comments, in LinkedIn DMs, and I'll give you an example. We have a we have a partner program. Jim mentioned Mary Catherine.

Peter Lisoskie [00:22:29]:
She runs our partner program. We have a lady that's a CEO. She does a lot of AI tool development, things like that. She developed an, relatable interactive that basically was a diagnostic tool and talked to people about their, their key pains. Right? And so then basically those key pains came into buttons. And one of them was too long a sales cycle, which I picked. And that went over to, it wasn't a one, like a YouTube short. It was like a 5 to 7 minute video.

Peter Lisoskie [00:22:58]:
And at the end, what she does is she said, hey, if this resonates with you and you want to find out more about what we do, go ahead and tap on this upcoming bug that's in screen, and you can set a meeting. Now here's the result she's getting. She's been doing this quite a bit. She sends these out in LinkedIn to DMs that are just connected with her, so they are cold. She's getting 70% to set meeting rate. Now, I don't know about you, but even with DM text, I don't know anybody who's getting that because she's there. She's talking, she's engaging, she's asking them to interact. She's addressing these change of perspectives and the bridge.

Peter Lisoskie [00:23:38]:
And then taking that and just doing a simple frictionless in screen button. Right? So that's an example there where you can go out to any of these. You can do these awareness. The other ones, when you get to consideration, it's use cases, it's competitor playbooks, it's customer successors. All these can be relatable. But here's the thing. When you do that, we have a thing called a home element. You could have them come in and go in consideration, say, what do you want to learn about? Do you want to learn about use cases, frequently asked questions? You want to learn about customer success stories? Do you want to learn about price? Let them choose.

Peter Lisoskie [00:24:12]:
And so they're doing this all in video experiences, but if it was me as a SaaS founder, I'm guiding them through this. They're getting to know me, the CEO and founder. They're getting to know how I interact and talk with people, which is the key thing. Right? So that's where it gets, where it gets very powerful. Okay. So that's the one now over on podcasting. And Jim is putting together all kinds of templates for us now. So we have this other thing called reminders because in my world of software, there's 3 key elements that we need to do as a SaaS founder.

Peter Lisoskie [00:24:50]:
Number 1, we got to make this thing super easy and intuitive. You know, you've heard of UX and UI, Right? So people have to be able to come in and intuitively go, oh, okay. I know how this thing works. Right? Keep it simple. Secondly, you have to teach them you have to get them from point a to point b as fast as possible. In other words, they gotta be able to do, you know, think of, I always use the analogy, think of Excel. You remember when Excel came out 25 years ago, people could go into Excel and they could add up numbers and do sums and averages and things like that. Well, Excel, if you want to can hold, do a whole financial statistical modeling, but it's easy.

Peter Lisoskie [00:25:31]:
You can start with some, get from point a to point b and go, Hey, I accomplished that. Then the third thing is, this is where reminders comes in. It's gotta be sticky. Any product has to be sticky, which means it gets used over and over and over again. Think about, you know, like your mics and things that you guys, sell on Amazon, whatever product you pick, that product has to be good enough in the different use cases for the person to go. That's my go to mic. I'm using that thing over and over. It's got stickiness.

Peter Lisoskie [00:26:00]:
Right. And they're probably going to keep it and they're going to use it and they're not going to go to another mic because they love it and it works. Right. So this whole thing with reminders, I came up with this idea of like, well, how could we create something that is sticky? So here's an example for you guys is live or podcast. You can create a system where you come on and you're talking to them in an interactive and you're saying, Hey, you're, I'm glad you're here. You, maybe you're new to my show. If you are, would you like to just, I'm just going to give you some contest shorts. You don't have to listen to the whole thing because you don't want to invest that time.

Peter Lisoskie [00:26:37]:
Right. People are like, I don't know deal casters. I don't even know if it's any good. So I want to listen to the top content. So you go, you, you want to listen to this content piece, this one, this one or this one, you give them 4 choices in their shorts. They're like a minute. So they tap on the button, they go listen to that. And then you could say, well, Hey, do you want to go back and listen to another one? Or would you like to now, go to that show? Or would you like to sign up to listen to our show on a regular basis? So they can either go back to the home and listen to another one, or they can tap on what's called a reminder button.

Peter Lisoskie [00:27:08]:
That reminder button will take them to their calendar. They can add it to Google calendar, to apple calendar, or to outlook, And it could be set for a certain amount of time, or it could be set for repeat forever. So you guys could have them on, on your calendar. And what's here's what's really cool about this, Chris and Jim, is when they get that reminder, the reminder comes in as a push notification, not an email because their inboxes are ruined. Everybody sees push cases on their phone and it's there on your iPhone or your Android phone. And all you have to, they do is they tap on the reminder up, pops a screen. There's a custom message that the person who did the relatable reminder is in there and there's a link. But the beauty about that, that link is another relatable interactive.

Peter Lisoskie [00:27:57]:
So now you can say, Hey, this is Chris I'm here with Darryl pastors live. I'm glad you guys put this on the show, or you, you put this on your reminder calendar. This, if you want to listen to the whole show, we just dropped it yesterday. Here's a button. It'll take you right to the show. Now you can even do more reminders to have them come back and you can say, look, you listened to the show. I'm this is another reminder. I just want to ask you, in another relatable.

Peter Lisoskie [00:28:22]:
What did you like? What did you like? What other content would you like to hear from us? So we can line up other guests that match with what you're, you're wanting to hear. So now lives, podcasts, they're no longer a talk at you. They're an interactive experience where the audience can grow and their voice can be heard. You see? And so this is where it gets very, very powerful. Now the backside, which is the one Jim's putting together for you guys is you guys got products and you got services, right? You got done for you services on how to set up lives and do, like, do things like that for companies. And you also have products that you sell. So when you build your, you can, you can ask for an opt in too, and you could say, Hey, if you want to join our community, just go ahead and opt in. That can be an, in any one of these interactives that you're doing in sequence.

Peter Lisoskie [00:29:12]:
But then what you're doing is you're coming back to them and you're reengaging them and saying, Hey, if you like our show deal counselors live, and you wanna know a little bit more about what we do in our business model, would you like to learn about the products we sell or would you like to learn about the services that we do and how we help other businesses just like you be able to go live? Let them choose. And when they choose, they're going over to your products and Amazon, or they're going to your live services, which could be yet another interactive where you can ask them questions and do diagnosis to determine, do they need a do it yourself, a done with you or a done for you, if you have that kind of model. Right. But the whole idea here is these interactives, you can use them for the entire customer journey. It's not just for marketing and getting customers. You can use it for support, for audience growth, for customer loyalty, for fans and ambassadors. It covers the entire spectrum.

Chris Stone [00:30:07]:
See, now it makes sense, Jim. Like, all it took was Peter to get on our show for this all to make sense. I told you. You know?

Peter Lisoskie [00:30:14]:
He could do it better.

Chris Stone [00:30:17]:
No. But, I mean so so my mind my mind goes a 1000000 miles an hour. And so when you're when you're going through these things, for me, if I'm a small business owner and I'm an entrepreneur, there are so many tools out there. And all of them are you're separated from them. You know? Like, it's a if this, then that CRM type of deal where there's text being launched here and there's text being launched here. This is more of a let me really get into understanding my, key consumer's journey and understanding, like, if you're here, you're either gonna go here or you're gonna go here. So let me create experiences for you in video that allow that actually serves people. Right? It's not a it's it's not it's very personal and very human as opposed to something that is just launched from Salesforce or or ConvertKit or all of these things that are the if this, then that kind of thing.

Chris Stone [00:31:27]:
And so if you set these up, Peter, it you know, you could literally, get this set up and have it, you know, scale properly. Right? You're not you're not wasting your time with a bunch of potential people that really aren't your customer. Right?

Peter Lisoskie [00:31:44]:
Exactly.

Chris Stone [00:31:45]:
They really might not like or trust you.

Peter Lisoskie [00:31:47]:
Exactly. And that's the, you know, see, I always when I was thinking about this, because look, we're here, the 3 of us. Right? I can't, you know, like I'm on radio. I can talk to people, but I can't see them. They hear my voice. This is better because we could see, but it's the 3 of us. Right? So that's great. Or, you know, the best is I'd love to fly out Chris and have dinner with you.

Peter Lisoskie [00:32:08]:
Same with Jim, but I gotta get in the plane. I gotta fly out. I gotta spend the money. I gotta spend the time. I can't scale that. Right. So I'm sitting here, I'm thinking, how can I do what you just said, Chris, where I can plug in? I can be relatable. I can be genuine and authentic, but more importantly, I can reach across the aisle and I can let have their voice be heard because that's what people are looking for now.

Peter Lisoskie [00:32:32]:
And how do I do that? I always say it's like having a coffee chat with a 100000 people at a time. Right? Because, you know, what I just explained in the podcast or lives or webinars, whatever you do in the digital realm, you could do it in the physical realm, bricks and mortars. Think of dentists inviting people in for their 6 month cleaning HVAC companies in the fall. You gotta get your furnace done in the spring. You gotta get your conditioning done. This is all basically you set it up once and you forget it and it runs like a machine, but the machine is always that founder and owner talking to their customer base. So they get to know them. They get to be heard.

Peter Lisoskie [00:33:11]:
They get to interact with them. That's the power of relatable. That's how it's different. Because you know, I didn't tell you this, but we talk all the time is all the marketing you just talked about, the CRMs, the HubSpot, the Salesforce, the email market, it's all arms length, all all arms length. And you know what these people do, then they go, well, I gotta know how these people are thinking. So we'll invent data analytics, which again is still more arms length. I say, would you rather just talk to people at yes. Do we have analytics of full suite? Yes, we do.

Peter Lisoskie [00:33:44]:
And you can do AB split testing. You can do you know, if you're doing one product against another, you can do all that in a relay. But I say the most important thing is getting in front of the camera with your audience, with your customer base, with your fans and ambassadors, and getting feedback, interacting, engaging, letting them choose their own experience, but also becoming familiar. I'll tell you a quick story. Jim knows one of my lead developers, Rion, and we were talking about these reminders and Rion says to me, he goes, well, I don't get it. He goes, why don't we just send him a text message or an email? I said, Rion, look, you and I have been working together for 5 years now. I said, if all I did was send you text messages in Slack, do you think we'd have the same relationship we have now? I've never met the guy in person. It's all been through video.

Peter Lisoskie [00:34:31]:
And he sat back in his chair and he went, oh, I get it. Because it's this whole interaction with video, even though I'm not there, we are here together in the old pastor's lot right now.

Chris Stone [00:34:45]:
Right. And we have people that are in the chat too. They're, you know, whether it's whether it's Richard or Rome or doc or Scott and all these people that are, that are in here. And and, apparently, Jim, you need your your dog pop. Doc, I just noticed my my dog pop. But, like so we we have relationships with with people that come in on the chat, and there are other, live shows. You know, sometimes you've you're like, the chat's going, you know, bonkers. Other times, it's not.

Chris Stone [00:35:16]:
And you have you have these relationships with people. You have inside jokes with, with people. And then by the time you meet them actually in real life, it's like you like, they're all of the all of the like, there's so much stuff that's out of the way. And, like, this is the person that I already know. And I think what really resonated with me was you were talking about how when when someone's creating these relate these these relatables and it's actually the CFO or the CEO or the founder of the company that's actually doing that. And for me, whenever I'm, you know, when I'm investing $39 a month for a piece of software or I'm investing, you know, whatever it is, if I know who the founders are and I'm, you know, like, I'm I'm joining the town hall on Sunday night or I you know, and I and, like, somehow, there's just something different about that and understanding that if if I really needed to have a a contact with the guys at at ECAM or if I needed to, you know, to touch base with with with somebody that I know at a particular company, there's just something about that that gets me more invested in in in a company. But, I mean, is that is that something that that resonates with you as well, Peter?

Peter Lisoskie [00:36:36]:
No. It that's what you just described is exactly it, Chris, which is you want to be felt like you're being treated like a person, not a wallet. You want to be heard. Right? And all the things you the way you just explained it in your own way is exactly what I was talking about. This is what people are looking for and what they want. I you know, here's the thing. I will say this. If you're a busy CEO or founder or whatever, the and you have a staff, you can just get in front of the camera and you can do your relatable, and you can have the staff build them.

Peter Lisoskie [00:37:09]:
They can knock them out for you. You don't have to do them yourself, but I'm saying you do need to get in front of a camera. And, you know, the funny thing is one of our mantras in my company is, I say, weed our own dog food. And what I mean by that is we use the tool probably as much or more than our customers do. And when I look, I've built this tool when I first got, I started, I, you know, I got Darren Head's light. I'm looking at camera going, what, what do I say? See, right. And so it, you know, we have AI scripts where it writes AI writes a script. We have manual scripts, and then we have what's called bullet points and it, you know, it's kind of like, you remember when you were a kid and you had your 1st bike and you had the training wheels on your bike.

Peter Lisoskie [00:37:53]:
Right. And you're on, I can't ride the bike without training wheels. And then there comes a day whether your dad rips them off and pushes you or you say I'm ready. Right. But it's no different than this after about 3 or 4 videos. And you're doing the scripts and things like that. You're going, you know what? I know my stuff. I'm just gonna write 3 bullet points.

Peter Lisoskie [00:38:13]:
I'm gonna talk off the top of my head. I only gotta talk. These are, you know, for shorts, I'm just gonna talk for a minute to 2 minutes. Right. You know, it just is getting over that hump. And I tell people all the time, it's like, look, if you have camera anxiety, get over yourself, just get in there, try it, do it a few times. In fact, if you screw up even better, I am not about filters. I am not about slick video.

Peter Lisoskie [00:38:37]:
I'm about you talk to these people. And if you happen to screw up a few times, it just makes you more human. They're going, Hey, this person's just like me. Right. That's relatability.

Chris Stone [00:38:49]:
I love it. I love it. Because they yeah. I mean, when things are too polished, I just think the the the trust I mean, there's the yeah. There's just that that that balance there where you just are like, listen. And I you know, that that you know, that's why we're live is because I I have, perfectionism. It's a it's a it's a huge problem. And I couldn't do anything.

Chris Stone [00:39:11]:
I was frozen because and I was like, you know what? I'm gonna push this big red button and we're gonna go. And we're gonna create the show and we're gonna do this. And I think in a lot of ways, that's what this is because you just and that's what scaled what I'm doing is because people are. And then when I met people, they're like, this is the person that I see live. Right.

Peter Lisoskie [00:39:31]:
This is exactly the the person. Person with filters. Yep. Exactly.

Jim [00:39:35]:
Well, and and, you know, another thing too, Chris, that Peter and I have talked about is Mhmm. You know, especially because we're kinda talking about AI a little bit earlier is if I got a video from you that was your AI avatar Oh. And then I find out later that that wasn't really you, I'm not gonna have that trust. I'm like, what? Why why couldn't you take the time, like Peter said, to just take that one minute to do a quick video and send it to me as opposed to having, you know, AI do it for you.

Peter Lisoskie [00:40:05]:
Yeah. I, you know, to build off what Jim's saying too, Chris, I will tell you so what I do, and I tell people in our partner program. So if you're on LinkedIn, it doesn't matter. You can be on extra wherever, but, I comment, I'll find people that I want to get to know. And so I will, be, I don't even have to connect to them. I'll comment. And the thing I say, this is where Jim was talking about category 1. When you are doing anything online, I will tell people right now, my job is to antagonize the status quo.

Peter Lisoskie [00:40:39]:
I hate them. I do not want to be part of the status quo. I want to be my own person. I do me, you do you, but I will comment category. The snow lepers teaches you when you are going to write content, do not write content free dumpster fire garbage content. Like you hear, like, here's my marketing playbook, how I made 600,000 a year, blah, blah. I was in, I was in the gutter and I almost died. And now I'm a multimillion.

Peter Lisoskie [00:41:09]:
You've heard all these stupid stories. Right? It's all status quo blah blah blah. Right? So when I and everybody else that is following Soul Leppard, you're writing content that gets people to think. It's reflective. It's basically you're expressing your unique point of view and change of perspectives in many of the different ways. So what I do is I go do that and I connect, and the people respond back. They they they're responding. And some of these people, like, I just connected.

Peter Lisoskie [00:41:35]:
We have a person coming into our partner program. She has nearly a 1000000, connections, a 1000000 followers on LinkedIn. She's an executive producer for Netflix series, for the History Channel. All I did was do that. I contacted, and then here's what I did. I turned on my camera and relatable. I put down I didn't even put down bullet points. I just turned on the teleprompter that's inside relatable, and I I told her, well, this is call her Sally.

Peter Lisoskie [00:42:00]:
I said, hey, Sally. I just wanna tell you that I really love the impact that you're making on LinkedIn and the type of, content that you're producing. And as you know, we've been commenting back and forth, and I love what you have to say for your audience. And we're trying to make an impact too. This is what Relatable isn't does, and I give them the just a quickie. And I say, you know, if this resonates with you and you wanna set a meeting with me to talk about that, there's gonna be an upcoming button. You that's my meeting. You can go ahead and set a meeting.

Peter Lisoskie [00:42:26]:
If not, that's okay too. We could just keep coming and following each other's comments. So Jim knows this story, but, Chris, I get 80% setting a meeting, and these are big, big influential people. Yeah. And, and I just was in one of my communities the other day. This guy was talking and he said, someone sent me a video that wasn't relatable because we hadn't got to that person yet. But he said, I immediately did it. He said, because it's so different.

Peter Lisoskie [00:42:53]:
Nobody does it. Everybody's doing DM texting. You know, like, if you're on LinkedIn. Right? First of all, you get you get the connection, and then the big no no is people come in and pitch you, and you go, okay. They're blocked. First of all, that's it. Don't hold down. We all that's like getting the robocall.

Peter Lisoskie [00:43:08]:
But the second thing is you come in, they connect, and they start asking you questions. You go, oh, they're trying to sell me. Right? BS meter at it all the time high. So you can shake your head. We we all go through this, but wouldn't it be refreshing and be different if you just came in and said, hey, I'm Chris Stone. I'm just here. I just wanted to get to know you. I'd love to have a meeting with you.

Peter Lisoskie [00:43:28]:
I'm not trying to sell you anything. I just, I just want to talk to you so we can start a relationship. If you'd like to do that, there's a button coming up. Just go ahead and tap on and set a meeting. Watch what happens. I mean, you get all kinds of people coming out of the woodwork because you're being yourself. You're being relatable. You're being.

Peter Lisoskie [00:43:45]:
And one of the things that I wanna mention for anybody on your show, it's free. I don't charge for it. I tell people, look. The relatable tool, it's a cool tool, but it's not as important as guys thinking the framework of how do you reconnect with your relatability. And that means how do you express thinking about them? You know, our top value statement, Jim knows this, is how do we give first? Right? And I will always live by that as the founder and CEO of this company. Because when you come at it from a giving perspective and saying, look, I'm not here to sell you something, I'm here to try to help you to give, but I wanna connect in a way to you that's relatable and authentic. So I actually wrote a book. It's a part of the category design is you do category design, company design, product design, but then you do a framework.

Peter Lisoskie [00:44:36]:
And the framework is the book that I wrote called Be Relatable, The Eye Opening Habit of a New Category of Human. And the Habakkuk for anybody that listens to your show, I'll send it out to them free of charge. It is a methodology and a mind, a model of how do you be reliable. If you want to use the tool. Great. If you don't, you just want to do it manually. That's okay too. I just want people, the thing that I, you know, at my age and the number of things I've been through, I wanna create impact in a movement.

Peter Lisoskie [00:45:09]:
The money will,

Chris Stone [00:45:11]:
sure.

Peter Lisoskie [00:45:11]:
The impact is more important and the movement is how do we create this movement of the relationship economy? That's where we're at. This is not something that is coming. It is here. It's already here. It's just about how do you make that strategic shift now from lead generation over to demand generation.

Chris Stone [00:45:32]:
Wow. That's incredible. I you know, and and while you're when you were talking about this, and and it's like, obviously, you're here. Relatable is your product. I think in general, whether whether you're just, you know, someone that can can afford, you know, a video program or whatever, you have to understand, like, I equate it to this. So, like, we, we have this program that we use called pod match. I don't know if you're familiar with it, Peter, but it's basically like, you know, it's it's a dating service for for for podcasters. Like, you know, am I gonna have this guest on my show? Or, you know, if I'm a guest, can I be on this particular host? And it is shocking to me, Peter, how many people put themselves out there as potential podcast guests, and they don't have video.

Chris Stone [00:46:22]:
And I just think to myself, okay. I understand that the podcast, medium in and of itself, you know, can be only audio. And so I I totally understand that. And I'm, you know, I, you know, I'm an audio nerd. And that's that's where it started for me. But, like, if you're not doing video with it, you're just not choosing to be as relatable to other people as as possible. And so what we're looking at or when I'm looking at for my clients, potential people that could be on their shows, and they don't have a YouTube channel, or they don't have a video when you open up their profile to say, hi. I'm Peter.

Chris Stone [00:47:03]:
I'd love to be on your show, you know, or, you know, or or whatever. It it it is you're just missing that that that element of potential for you to do that and and be able to do it. Like, you just said, get over yourself. And, you know, you know, this is, you know, it's 2024, and we we have to fire up the camera. And we have to start, you know, you know, really being more relatable to people. And it it it I don't know why that just I just you know, when you were talking about that, I was like, oh my god. On Pod Match, nobody's got these videos. And I I like, you 9 times out of 10, I'm passing on these people because they don't have a way for me to actually see how they show up.

Jim [00:47:48]:
Yeah. Well, and Chris and and I'll let Peter talk about this, but one of the things that Peter's actually started doing and and is doing it with a relatable, it's like you can create a relatable to kind of create that, are you, you know, a good candidate for our show? And and, Peter, you wanna talk about how you and Mary Katherine are doing that?

Peter Lisoskie [00:48:07]:
Yeah. So we started a a podcast show called Can You Relate. And, we'll probably have you guys on too, because it's we're looking for people that are making an impact and have a possibility for a movement. Right? If you look at there's so many cool stories. I mean, I'm a big Steve Jobs, fan, you know, and he was around. He actually was a forefather of category design. You guys probably remember in 2007 when he was up on stage, and he held up the iPhone, and he said, this is a new category of communication advice. This is before Play Bigger, before any of this stuff, before, you know, my friend Christopher Lockett and his friends wrote that book.

Peter Lisoskie [00:48:46]:
But, you know, this podcast is really about having those kind of people. So I said, well, look, eat your own dog food. We have a relatable, it's called the guest interactive and I'm on there talking to them and I'm going, Hey, I want to find out a little bit more about you and I ask a series of questions. Right. So if they ask her the certain questions right, which means they are making an impact, they do have some form of a movement, they go into, okay, here's where you sign up for the show, blah, blah, blah. If they don't, then it's like, hey, we'll be in touch with you soon, And here's some more information about our show and what we're looking for. Right? But we do get you know, we will get in touch with them and things like that, but you can these relatable is for people who do lives or podcasts. You can use them for guest screening.

Peter Lisoskie [00:49:32]:
You can use them for these reminder systems. You can use them for your back end selling your products or services. Whatever you wanna do. It's I wanna just create something that was the entire customer journey, the entire client journey. But like you said, Chris, see, I look at it like this. I think it goes even beyond what you said, Chris. I think right now in this day and age, it's disrespectful to your customers and clients if you're not on video talking to them. I really do because it's like, think about it this way.

Peter Lisoskie [00:50:05]:
You talk about relationships. Right? Chris, let's say you your significant other wife or significant other. Right? If all you did, like I said, with Rian was text that person or email that person, but you never were in in front of them talking to them. This is the best we can do with video, but we are in front of each other talking. I mean, don't you think that's a little disrespectful to that person?

Chris Stone [00:50:33]:
100%.

Peter Lisoskie [00:50:33]:
That's the way I look at it. So I tell people that's why I say get over yourself because if you really care about people and you really care about your customers and you really want to create interaction and reach out across the aisle to them, you need you can't be there physically, like I said, for every single customer, especially if you have a large customer base, but you can certainly be there for them in video. And you can talk face to face. I mean, think about what our world would be like if the politicians use a tool like Relatable and had a series of fireside chats with their constituency, asking them what they thought about when this upcoming vote's gonna happen. What would that be like? It's like, wow, that would be like super cool. Cause that means they're actually listening to me. I voted in mid to office. Relatable could do that too.

Peter Lisoskie [00:51:22]:
You know, this is where it's like thinking differently. This is the framework of being relatable. That's why I say you start with the framework. You get reconnect. We all have our relatability. I mean, I'll tell you just a quick story. So in all my travels, I've been to Abu Dhabi, Saudi Arabia. I've been to India.

Peter Lisoskie [00:51:43]:
I've been all over Asia, all over Europe, you know, China, Japan, Singapore, Malaysia, everywhere you, South America, different countries in South America. And you know what I found out as a young man, when I would sit in, like, for example, you go into Abu Dhabi. Beautiful. Beautiful. And, but it's about as different as it can be from a cultural differences. Right. And how they view, even view women and things like that. Right.

Peter Lisoskie [00:52:10]:
Right. So I don't agree with everything they do, but I would sit with different families when I was over there on business, and I have to go through, you know, sometimes through a translator. But here's the thing. No matter where you go in the world, when you start talking about family, love, kindness, fairness, empathy, compassion, it is the same everywhere. Everywhere you go, it's the same. And so it dawned on me. It's like, wow, there is some, I don't know if you guys are fans of Stephen Covey with the 7 habits. I actually Sure.

Peter Lisoskie [00:52:40]:
The story I met Stephen Covey. I got to talk to him one time, and he he I had a real defining moment. We have time. I'll I'll tell that story here. But, but the the thing is it's about being relatable. It's getting into those foundational principles, not focusing so much about, hey, where am I gonna sell you my product or service? It's how am I going to connect with you? If you look and you're gonna hear more about this, we are shifting away from b to b and b to c to h to h, human to human. And you're gonna see more and more of that stuff fading away with the attention economy at lead gen and more in the relationship economy, human to human connection, and creating demand for products and services. And you let the buyer choose that journey towards demand because that's what they're doing already.

Peter Lisoskie [00:53:28]:
Right? So

Chris Stone [00:53:31]:
Good stuff. This is, you know, this is you know, like, we we absolutely need to do the the Stephen Covey story maybe in in part 2, when when we do this, but we're already, at at time. Ladies and gentlemen, make sure that you're, checking out. We've got all of the links in the show notes for, the audio podcast as well as the video podcast, home.relatable.pro. Check out Relatable, future proof your business. Relatable fits how people can buy and buy from you at scale, and a cute little jalapeno. So, you know, you know, that's, you know, just side note there. Jim, take us home, sir.

Jim [00:54:16]:
Yeah. This has been great, Peter. You know, I love what we're doing. I I love all the advancements. You know, it's not like anything's being sat on, you know, continuing to evolve and make it sticky for people. So, you know, thank you for joining us. Yeah. We'll have to do this again, sometime soon.

Jim [00:54:35]:
And, any what's what's the best way for people to connect with you, Peter?

Peter Lisoskie [00:54:41]:
Probably, you know, a lot of you, I'm sure, that are listening, just go to LinkedIn, look up Peter Lisowski. My name's right up there. You can, connect with me there. And, you know, I'm I'd be happy to to talk with you if you wanna set up a time to have a quick meeting, you know, just so I always tell people, look. You know, the best way to start a relationship is through a a video chat. So, you know, my dad told me just to my last closing remarks, my dad was a full blooded Ukrainian. And, when I was a little boy, he used to call me Piotr because Piotr is, in Russian or Ukrainian for Peter. And he goes, you know, Piotr, he goes, in life, you talk to everybody because number 1, you don't know what they know.

Peter Lisoskie [00:55:21]:
And number 2, you don't know who they know. And I talk to every I talk to homeless people. I talk to everybody, all the way to CEOs, executives because everybody has a story, and everybody is relatable. And at the end of the day, I'll bring it home with, guys, if you don't believe it, believe it now. People do business with people they're like, no. I trust.

Chris Stone [00:55:45]:
Awesome. Good stuff. Good stuff. It okay. So it's not not only what they know, but who they know.

Peter Lisoskie [00:55:52]:
Yeah. Good stuff.

Chris Stone [00:55:54]:
Alright, ladies and gentlemen.

Peter Lisoskie [00:55:56]:
Have a whole I could go through I'll tell you look. So I got stories with Stephen Covey. My brother-in-law was Doug Creighton, who's Michael Creighton's brother. You know, Michael Creighton, Jurassic Park? I have a whole story about Doug Creighton. He's the longest survivor of bone marrow cancer. He gave me seven key. Quest there's all kinds of stuff about life. If you guys wanna get into stuff like that, I have so many stories of talking to different people around the world, going to ancient temples.

Peter Lisoskie [00:56:23]:
I met a a a a witch lady thing that she read my bones in, Taiwan, and she said I was gonna get a divorce, and I did. I mean, I could tell you all kinds of things that happened to me. Maybe just crazy stories, you know, about different people I've met in my life. Some notable, some not, but, you know, impactful kind of thing.

Chris Stone [00:56:45]:
That sounds like after party content there, Peter.

Peter Lisoskie [00:56:49]:
Yeah. We can turn the docast live into docastor's party. Everybody grab a whiskey, and let's talk.

Jim [00:56:56]:
Let's do it.

Chris Stone [00:56:57]:
Alright, folks. Thanks for joining us. Make sure you connect, with Relatable and Peter, on LinkedIn, Peter Lazoski. And as always, don't fear the gear.

Jim [00:57:09]:
Thanks for listening to Dealcasters. Congratulations. You've taken another step forward in your content creation journey. Please don't forget to hit the subscribe or follow button here in your favorite podcast player so you can be reminded every time we drop an episode. We love hearing from

Chris Stone [00:57:27]:
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Jim [00:57:46]:
have questions about this episode or have something you want us to review, you can also email us at Dealcasters at Dealcasters dot live. Thanks again for listening, and you know the deal. Don't fear the deal.